Marcelo
D'Salete,
Stripburger 54
Marcelo D'Salete about Brazilian comics
It
happened years ago, on a dull, rainy day, when a message from far-away,
sunny
Brazil dropped into Stripburger's
e-mail box. OK, I added “dull” and “rainy”
for effect, but the message was real. It contained few
words, but quite
some beautiful illustrations. We soon discovered that its sender,
Marcelo
D’Salete, is known as a comic strip writer as well. And that he is even
very
prolific in that field. His comics - sometimes brutally realistic, at
other
times lyrically impressionistic – gave us the chance to peek into a
comic strip
scene, which up until that time had been quite unknown to us. Marcelo’s
first
publication in our magazine (No.47) was followed by a second (No.48),
the
second by a third (No.49), and as we were working on the latest, the
fourth, we
started itching to find out more about the context from which such
comics as
his originate. Marcelo proved to be a highly informative source and he
generously revealed some key facts about the Brazilian comics scene:
its
beginnings, the current state of affairs, and not least about his own
comic
strip output. This interview with him is a brief introduction to the
selection
of Brazilian comics awaiting you in the depths of this edition. He was
interviewed by KA and GR.
Please,
excuse our ignorance, but the Brazilian comic strip is, frankly
speaking, quite
a mystery to us. Could you, for starters, depict what the situation in
your
country is, regarding the comic strip? Are comics popular, widespread,
or are
they fighting for their place under the (Brazilian) sun?
The medium of comic strips is
well-known in Brazil. Of course there are
different kinds of comics aimed at different readers. The majority of
mainstream comics come to Brazil from abroad. On the other hand, there
are many
original comic strip creations by Brazilian authors, which are meant
for
children. That kind of comics is very well received and sells well. In
fact, in
Brazil, comics were long considered as something made exclusively for
children
and young readers. These days, young, “alternative” comic strip artists
are
looking for a new, adult target audience. However, that does not mean
they are
neglecting their young readers. These authors want to show that they
can use
the medium of the comic strip to express their views on highly
variegated
themes, and in an intelligent way.
Can
you tell us a bit about the history of the Brazilian comic strip? When
can we
start talking about the comic strip establishment in Brazil?
The comic strip was first born in Brazil around the year 1869 – its
midwife was the Italian illustrator Angelo Agostini. He created some
kind of
narrative with images and text, especially by placing the text below
the image.
What he was creating was still very close to illustration, even if we
can
already detect a narrative element in his work. It was significant that
Agostini published his images in the paper O Diabo Coxo (The Hunchback
Devil). Agostino was followed by many other works (Brazilian, but
especially foreign), which united images and text into a sensible whole.
Brazilian comics began to be
better known in the second half of the 20th
century. The most famous Brazilian author of comics is Mauricio de
Souza. His
characters from Turma da Mônica (Monica’s Class)
are known
nationwide. He clearly understood the potential of those characters;
today they
adorn all conceivable commercial products. You will hardly find a kid
who
hasn’t read at least one of his comics. Another author from the 60s I
would
like to namecheck is Ziraldo, who is exceedingly technically skilled in
his
strokes and composition. Ziraldo was interested in topics drawn from
culture
and Brazilian folklore, which gave the personalities of his characters
a very
special touch.
Are
there any practices in Brazilian traditional (fine) arts which involve
certain
comic strip elements, or otherwise emphasise the narrative element?
Maybe... In the North-East of Brazil there is the so called literatura
de cordel,* which
is possibly reminiscent of comics
in its manner of production, being cheap and simple. The image on the
“cordel”
illustrates a text. However, in this form the narrative does not spring
up from
the images themselves. The baroque was an important artistic era in
Brazil and
among its art we can find some of the genealogy of the world of comics.
At that
time, the church was using images as didactic instruments, since a
great part
of the population was illiterate. The stories of Christianity were more
easily
accessible through painted images. However, a different, modern context
was key
to the birth of the comic strip – dissemination through the medium of
print.
Does
your country have any kind of indigenous comics industry? If not, I
presume that “mainstream” comics get imported? If so, where from? For
example,
what comics did you grow up on?
As a kid I used to read stories by the Brazilian
author Mauricio de Souza, later I started discovering stories about
American
superheroes. As a teenager I was into Sandman by Neil Gaiman,
Katsuhira
Otoma’s Akira and the collection of
short stories Mundo Cão by Michelanxo Prado. A friend,
the graffiti
artist Pato, introduced me to the work of the Brazilian Lourenço
Mutarelli, his
book Desgraçados. When I read those stories, I realised
that the world
of the comic strip was much larger than I had thought. Despite the fact
that I
had been drawing from an early age, “mainstream” comics remained a very
foreign
thing to me. I couldn’t imagine myself drawing heroes. The type of
narration I
discovered with Prado and Mutarelli showed me how comics were linked to
literature and film, two worlds that are much closer to me.
This
is not a very important question, actually, but I would like to
verify the rumour that I heard some time ago. Namely, I’ve been told
that the
Italian comics publishing giant Bonelli is a big name in the Brazilian
comics
market... Is that correct? (If so, could that possibly mean that the
comic
strip experience of an average comics reader in Brazil is similar to
the one of
readers from the countries of former Yugoslavia, such as Slovenia…?)
Yes, the publishing house Bonelli is active in Brazil. I know a bit of Ken
Parker and Dylan Dog, but besides that I don’t really know
much
about that part of comics production.
Is there a strong division between “mainstream” comics
and “alternative” comics in Brazil?
There seems to be. There is a stable market for mainstream comics. A
big
part of that market consists of comics by North-American authors.
European
comics are a small niche. A yet smaller market is Brazilian alternative
comics.
The alternative comics that I know of are created by authors who wish
to
present their work to the public, but are rarely noticed by the bigger
publishing houses. That happens for two reasons: for a long time,
Brazilian
publishers didn’t see a marketable product in Brazilian comics; the
other thing
is, these authors can’t afford to produce new comics continuously,
since they
get no paid jobs in this field. So what follows is a vicious circle.
All of
this can be further linked to the fact that Brazil has a remarkably
high
percentage of illiteracy (one of the highest in Latin America!). There
are
groups of independent comics artists which deal intensively with the
question
of production – and, above all, the distribution – of local comics.
It’s
necessary to have (and keep), besides big publishers, also such
publishers that
deal with alternative comic strips.
Could you remind us of any
Brazilian comic strip artists or comics that
reached worldwide fame? (I also mean emigrant authors of Brazilian
origin.) I regret
to have to admit that I can’t think of any right now on my own...
The most famous, popular and oldest is Mauricio de
Souza, who publishes his work in various countries in the world. After
the year
1990 a
lot of people appeared who dealt with comics in a more
American mainstream fashion – by that I
mean the method of production, which consists in authors splitting
individual
phases of production (pencil drawing, inking, colouring, finishing
work...).
I highly value the
work of Marcelo Quintanilho, who
currently lives and works in Spain, mainly because of his strong,
original
expression.
As far as I know, the biggest
comics scene on the South-American
continent is in Argentina, where they also have some internationally
recognised
authors (like Joséja Muñoza, for example). Is there any
exchange of comic strip
influences between the two countries?
There is some communication. But, sadly, it’s quite
weak. Considering their geographical closeness, it should be stronger.
The
works that I saw most frequently in older Brazilian (alternative)
magazines,
were by the Argentinian cartoonist Carlos Nina. As for Jose
Muñoz, I only know
about one of his works to have been published in Brazil - Billie
Holiday.
A more recent publication is Che (illustration: Alberto and
Enrique
Breccia, script: Hector German Oesterheld). In 2008, I was invited to
the
festival Viñetas Sueltas in Buenos Aires. That was a
very good
experience. I was introduced to the works of excellent drawers and
scenarists:
Jorge Perez, Lucas Varela, Salvador Sanso, Ivan Bruno, Angelo Mosquito,
Albert
Vazquez, Brais Rodriguez. The event also included exhibitions and
discussions.
It’s undeniable that the medium of the comic strip is very strong in
Argentina.
It was on that very “journey” that I discovered Breccia’s work.**
Extraordinary. Brazilian publishing houses completely ignore the
quality of
these artists' work. I was lucky to have my comic book debut Noite
Luz
published in Argentina, in Spanish, by Thomas Dassance’s publishing
house Ex-Abrupto.
These days there are comics
festivals are sprouting up like mushrooms
worldwide. I suppose that even your enormous home country has a couple
...
Which festival(s) do you like taking part in?
An important Brazilian international comic strip
festival is Festival Internacional de Quadrinhos in Minas
Gerais. I went
there in 2004, in
association with the magazine Front. This year I attended a
meeting of
comic strip authors in Rio Grande do Sul. There are other festivals as
well. In
São Paulo, which is a huge city, there isn’t a comics festival
that is
accompanied by exhibitions and related events (discussions, jam
sessions) for
the alternative comics scene. Which is a pity. As for festivals outside
of
Brazil, I contributed to the 7th Luanda Cartoon
festival in Angola
this year. If it hadn’t been for visa problems, I would have taken part
personally as well. Unfortunately, I don’t have enough time, so I only
take
part in a few such events.
Among others, you are sharing
the pages of this edition’s Brazilian
sector with Daniel Bueno, Jaca, Laura
Teixeira, Rafael Sica ... Do you know any of these authors, what can
you tell
us about them?
Daniel Bueno is well-known in the local illustration
business. He also originates his illustrations digitally. He is one of
the best
in this field. Jaca belong to the older generation. I first saw his
originals
at the FIQ (comics festival) in 2004. Paintings. His comic
strip
language is very specific. Distracted, somewhat rough, complex. He
plays with
the phenomenon of pop culture and its massiveness ... His works are
characterised by an emphasised “plasticity”, as are those by Laura
Teixeira,
for example. I went to university with Clayton Junior, as well as with
the
animator Adams Carvalho; I learned quite a lot from their work during
our
studies. I think I only encountered the work of Rafael Sica this year.
I liked
it. His narrative has a very specific rhythm in the frame of comic
strip logic,
full of experimentation.
Who are, in your opinion, the
most interesting Brazilian comics authors
at the moment? Can you mention a name to us, which we should keep in
mind, or
pay attention to? (We are particularly interested in authors from
alternative
fields.)
There are quite a few so-called alternative comic
strip authors (by that I mean those outside mainstream markets) active
in
Brazil at the moment, who have a strong and original approach.
Lourenço
Mutarelli is one of the most important authors of that kind. He started
off in
the early eighties and has kept his work outside the framework of the
conventional comic strip. Condensed. He has created his own niche with
his
immense production. And it is only today, 20 odd years later, that he
is known
and appreciated. Nevertheless, that is more due to his later work in
the film
industry and his literary endeavours – he is a writer as well. Some
other
important authors from Mutarelli’s era are Laerte Coutinho, Luis
Gê, Fernando
Gonzales, Angeli, Flávio Colin, Marcatti and Mauricio Pestana.
They are all
part of the alternative comic strip movement from the 1980s. Laerte
Coutinho
is, in terms of comic strip language, possibly one of the most creative
authors
on Brazilian ground. Marcelo Quintanilha (Gaú) is a
representative of the
younger generation. He published two books of short stories. Both focus
on the
microcosm of Rio de Janeiro. Quintanilha has a sophisticated
understanding of
the gesticulation, speech and rhythm of the city's inhabitants. Not
only has he
mastered the narrative perfectly, his drawings are an exquisite
delicacy, as he
works on every detail with great care.
Eloar Guazzelli is an author who
experiments with the
visuals and development of comic strip morphology. Besides short
stories, his
work deals with literary and historic texts. His syntax is emphatically
lyrical, surreal, open.
André Kitagawa is a
representative of a more classic
style of narration; his expression is sarcastic, tough and rough. His
graphics
are precise, almost surgical. He is able to balance lyricism, violence
and
cynical humour into a meaningful whole.
Two young and in my opinion very
good comic strip
authors are Rafael
Coutinho and Rafael Grampá.
And then
there is DW***,
a good cartoonist, but nevertheless poorly known in Brazil. I would
also like
to mention Guga Schulze and his comics album Saida 3; excellent
drawing
and a special kind of narration.
Another revelation I had this
year is Pedro Franz. He
develops original topics and he is dealing with them from different
points of
view, simultaneously maintaining control over the rhythm and tone of
the story.
Besides the above mentioned
artists there are others,
whom I did not mention for lack of space and memory.
Tell us about your own comic
strip creations now. More directly
speaking, what is the life of a cartoonist in Brazil like? Can you make
a living
by it, or do you do anything else?
I don’t work at comics exclusively. The market for
that is small in Brazil. I carried out two or three commercial
projects, which
brought me some money. In general, cartoonists tend to do illustrations
as
their main profession, which are considered a “safer” medium. I draw
comics
because of the complexity of the medium – through them, I can tell
people my
own stories. In general, I prefer to tell my own stories or stories
that
attract me. For that reason, I worked with writers like Kiko
Dinucci, Bruno Azevêdo and Eddy Gomez. I started drawing comics
at the end of
high school, basing them on stories by Kiko Dinucci, who is also a
musician and
a São Paulo samba specialist. Then quite a few years went by,
and during my studies
I was acquainted with the magazine Front, a
collective publishing project, managed by an internet group (the
founders of
the project were Kipper and Orlando). I contributed to six editions of
the
magazine. That was my school of comics. Big authors, such as Eloar
Guazzelli,
Oswaldo Pavanelli, Maxx, Theo Cordeiro, André Kitagawa etc.
published their
work in that zine. I was only a beginner. Later, I started publishing
in other
magazines, such as Graffiti, Ragu, +Soma, Suda Mery K! and Stripburger.
Now I have a full time job and I draw in my free time. In 2008 I
published a
comics album entitled Noite Luz; I didn’t earn much with it.
However,
that book brought me in contact with some people who liked it and I had
a
chance to talk with them. That’s priceless. If all goes well, I will
publish a
new album next year.
Can
you share with us what actually brought you to Stripburger? I
remember that you sent us some illustrations when you first made
contact with
us. We then asked you whether you drew comics as well, and it turned
out you
were actually very productive in that area ...
My first encounter with Stripburger
was through the internet. Daniel Bueno
sent me a message about European and South-American comics magazines. I
saw Stripburger’s web site and I liked what was
published there, so I sent my stories.
I was lucky enough to find someone who is inspired by my work.
I
find that the stories in your comics have something in common with
those of the Japanese cartoonist Yoshihiro
Tatsumi – not from an artistic
point of view, but
rather with their realistic themes, their feel for social reality, the
little
man as the protagonist, open endings... Do you know that author, were
you influenced by him? If not, who are your role models (in comics, as
well as
in other artistic forms)?
I’m not familiar with Tatsumi’s work. But thank you
for the hint. Some Japanese mangas represent a strong reference point
to me.
They certainly raised the complexity of comic strip expression to a
whole new
level. Katsuhiro Otomo, Tayo Matsumoto, Takehiko Inoue are real
geniuses of
that style. I find Akira one of the best works that I read in
my younger
years; due to its rhythm, cadence, and exceptionally sophisticated
form. The
eastern market is so big that even absurd creations, such as the first
part of
Tsutomu Nihei’s Noise or the obscure
stories about Eru-Guru by Suehiro Maruo etc. can find their
place in it.
In addition to manga authors, there are Japanese filmmakers that
surprise me
again and again. One of them is Takeshi Kitano. In fact, his film
expression is
closely linked to comic strip language. I have recently discovered
Takashi
Miika’s films. Audition, Ichi The Killer, Blue Harp and his
contribution
to theThree Extremes are fantastic! I
love Hitchcock, Tsai Ming-Iiang, Antonioni, Haneke, Kieślowsky,
Pontecorvo,
Cassavetes, Spike Lee. I have also watched some brilliant African films
like O
Cedo by Ousnam
Semben and Abouna by Mahamat-Saleh
Haroun.
Despite its ups and downs,
Brazilian film production
boasts some very special works. Glauber Rocha’s films, some films by
Rogério
Sganzela, Sergio Bianchi, Cláudio Assis, Luis Sergio Person,
Fernando Meireles,
Andrea Tonacci, Karin Aïnouz and Hector Babenko (among others)
contain strong
dialogues, which are from a Brazilian context.
About American comics... Quite
some time ago I read
Chris Ware’s Jimmy Corrigan. Simple plot, expressed through a
complex
form with an excellent scenic layout. Ware makes simple, everyday
things
significant. Creates a specific rhythm. And simultaneously he tackles
topics,
which are particularly sensitive to Americans: racism, weakness, etc.
I like reading Daniel Clowes
again and again,
especially his album Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron. I would
like to
point out another remake work, which is rarely discussed, but
represents an
absolute reference point to me; that’s The System by Peter
Kuper. A
complex, quiet and effective narration – it seduces you.
In 2008 I participated in a
comic strip festival in Algiers (Algeria),
where I came into personal contact with the French comic strip artist
Matthias
Lehman and Jeremy Nsingi and Barli Baruti from Congo. At a book fair I
was
introduced to the work of the European author Mark Turunen
(Finland); it excited and fascinated me. Some other European comics
artists
that I value highly are Mattotti, Stefano Ricci and Hugo Pratt (all
Italian).
Your
comics show, as it seems to me, your great sensitivity to
contemporary Brazilian social reality, especially of the marginal
social
groups. .. What is your relation to the world depicted in your comics?
Do you
narrate the stories first-hand, from your own experience, or do you get
them
from some other (information) channels?
A story can start in various
ways. Very often they are
born from discussions that I have with my friends, sometimes they come
from the
news, or they are based on something that happened in the street. The
first
story from the album Noite Luz is
based on a real fragment of place and time. A friend told me about a
girl who
worked in a night club. I took his anecdote and developed it into a
story of my
own. On some other occasion I was told about the death of an
acquaintance in a
fight between football fans. The story entitled Bulldog was born from this.
My latest story, which hasn’t
been published yet, is based on an unusual
event. A dark skinned man is standing in a parking place in front of a
big
shopping mall. He is surrounded by security guards. They are sure that
he is a
car thief. They beat him up. In fact, the man was the owner of one of
the cars.
Well, this story is already strong in itself, but I had to expand it. I
added
other elements and created a new story, which tells about prejudice,
racism,
crime and consumerism. These topics attract me in a certain way, that’s
why I
often reach for them. However, it seems to me that there is a certain
gap
between the Brazilian social context and the topics discussed by
Brazilian
comic strips.
Nevertheless, more than the
inspiration that triggers the story, these
days other aspects intrigue me: the methods and possibilities for the
story's
portrayal in the form of a provocative, intelligent, efficient and
unique
narrative. The choice of the main plot is important, but exploiting its
narrative and visual potentials is even more important.
While reading
your album (or rather, comic strip novel) Noite-Luz
I asked myself: is this a comic
book, is it literature, or is it already film? Is Marcelo a comic strip
artist,
a writer and a film director in one? Should Noite-Luz be placed with the
other comic books on the bookshelf, or would we rather put it next to
novels,
short stories and novellas?
I am glad that Noite
Luz made that
kind of impression on
you. It shows that comic strips can be as complex and profound as any
other
artistic form. A good artwork makes the public see reality from another
angle,
with a new set of eyes, with a renewed sensibility to it. I am
fascinated by a
variety of artistic forms, which undoubtedly affects my work. Through
the
medium of the comic strip I can combine diverse art genres in a
meaningful
whole. And, best of all, comic strip artists can, like writers, do
almost
everything ourselves.
In that same
work (and in other works you made that I had the
opportunity to see) the words are scarce, while the silences are loud,
screaming, all-encompassing; where there are any dialogues, they have
the
destructive power of a volcano. Can you explain to us, how do you see
silence –
both in your comic strip (very film-like) creations as well as in
general?
I think that
the imagery in comics can create many
possibilities of understanding. I am trying to research that field.
Words are
important. However, if they are not well applied, this can ruin the
story.
Pictures open the door to the imagination in unlimited ways. Whereas
the text,
when it is bad, closes this universe of possibilities, obstructs our
imagination and our reading – which happens with many traditional
comics. My
attention was drawn to this by Peter Kuper’s The System, as
well as by Akira, Noise
and some others (mainly comics). Perhaps the majority of comic strip
readers
aren’t used to reading images that effectively. In general, they tend
to
separate, define, catalogue, understand superficially. They almost
entirely
overlook the complexity of the images. It is true, that we live in a
world of
images, in which these images are essential. However, we are used to
only
reading them superficially. We do not enquire deeply about them, don’t
involve
ourselves in the details, we don’t understand their nuances. A comic
strip that
is well planned in terms of its form, demands from its readers to read
carefully, to enquire, to learn how to see and how to look. When I’m
working on
the plot of my comics, I (first) write a lot of dialogues. However,
when I
start drawing and perfecting them, I systematically do away with all
the
surplus text. The image itself should tell the story. Words help, but
silence
is most precious of all.
Marcelo, thank you very much for
your answers.
Take
a look at Marcelo’s works here: www.dsalete.art.br
* These are songs
in verses consisting of six lines; their content is usually of a
satirical
nature or based on contemporary events.
Songs of this kind are published in booklets (generally
consisting of
about 10 pages, with one song in each booklet), the covers of which are
traditionally adorned by woodcuts.
**
Enrique, Cristina and Patricia Breccia; the son and two daughters of
the late
Alberto Breccia (1919 - 1993), the legend of Argentinian comic strips.
*** You can read his comic strip Projection
on the pages of this very edition of Stripburger.
--------------------------------------------------------
ABOUT
THE AUTHOR
Marcelo
d'Salete (b. 1979) is a researcher and a
specialist in the field of Afro-Brazilian fine arts, with a Masters
degree in
art history and a degree in graphic design. An illustrator and comic
strip
artist, he has also worked as an art history and illustration lecturer.
His
comics have so far been published in the magazines Front, Grafitti,
Quadreca, Contos Bizarros, +Soma (all
in Brazil), Suda Mery k! (Argentina) and
Stripburger. He
produced some of his comics in collaboration with the writers Kiko
Dinucci,
Eddy Gomez, Bruno Azevêd and Edson Aran.
He
has illustrated various children’s books. He took
part in the exhibitions Consecuencias
do
Injuve
(Barcelona, Spain, 2003), Ilustrando em Revista
(touring exhibition, Brazil, from 2005 on)
and in the
exhibition of the original illustrations from the magazine Front
(along
with other Brazilian comic-strip authors like Eloar
Guazzelli, Jaca, Stefano Ricci and Toppi.
(Minas
Gerais, Brazil, 2003). He has also participated in some comic strip festivals:
Festival Viñetas Sueltas – Primer
Festival Internacional de Historietas de Buenos Aires, (Buenos Aires,
Argentina, 2008), I.
Festival International de La Bande Dessinée d’Alger, (Algiers,
Algeria, 2008) and
Luanda Cartoon (Luanda, Angola, 2010). He published a selection of his comics in the
independent album
Noite Luz (reviewed in the 49th edition
of Stripburger). He lives and works in Brazil.
SELECTED
BIBLIOGRAPHY AND MAGAZINE PUBLICATIONS
Quadreca n.12,
(Com-arte) (BR), 2001
Quadreca
n.13, (Com-arte)
(BR), 2003
Noite Luz, Via Lettera
(BR), 2008
Front
n. 10, Via Lettera (BR), 2002 (Trânsito)
Front n. 11, Via Lettera (BR), 2002 (Cheio de Azul)
Front
n. 12, Via Lettera (BR), 2002 (Noite Luz)
Front
n. 13, Via Lettera (BR), 2003 (Mamãe)
Front
n. 14, Via Lettera (BR), 2003
Contos
Bizarros, Abril (BR), 2003
Graffiti
76% quadrinhos n. 16, (BR), 2007
Suda
Mery K! n. 5, Ex-abrupto (AR), 2008
Graffiti
76% quadrinhos n. 17, (BR), 2008
Stripburger
št. 47, 2008 (Between Roses and Stars)
Stripburger
št. 48, 2009 (Sketch)
Stripburger
št. 49, 2009 (Fifteen
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